6.11 Portable Points

[Canadian Paddler]

Proposed by, Halifax seconded by Kingston Kayak
At the 2015 ACM it was decided to delay the implementation of Portable Points to explore options to address the various concerns raised with the original proposed format of Portable Points with the intention of bringing a revised proposal back to the 2016 ACM. The following is a revised proposal based on discussions to address these concerns for the introduction of Portable Points for the 2017 season.
Concerns raised at the 2015 ACM have been addressed as follows:
• Loss of multi-division events – the proposals have been revised to allow lower division events to remain multi-division events (e.g. Div 2/3 events), aiding the financial viability of these events and ensuring that families and clubs can take paddlers to events that suit the needs of a wider range of paddlers.
• Carrying forward all points on promotion – the proposal now allow only points earn by paddling up in the high division to be carried forward upon promotion to that division, rather than allowing all points to be carried forward into the new division.
• Impact of paddle ups on host division points – the proposals have been amended so that host division points are calculated as if paddle up paddlers were not there. Those paddling up are awarded the same points as the host paddler with the closest (better) score.

Introduce Portable Points for the 2017 season, amending the rules as set out in the published supporting document. Additionally, to ensure that events in the managed calendar for 2017 are accordance with the Competition Designations set out in the revised rules.

[Nick Penfold]

The proposal paper is rather long, because quite a lot of small changes are needed. This is PP in a nutshell:
Aims
Additional races, and access to bigger water, for paddlers.
Improve event profitability and success through increased numbers.
Single-division events for clear focus on the standard of the event - but multi-division events where single-division events not practical.
Competitions
All Prem and Div 1 races will be stand-alone events.
Div 2, 3 and 4 races may be stand-alone or combined, but at combined events there will be separate races, points and prizes for each division.
Maximum Points Levels by Division
Points will be loaded for equivalence between divisions. The maximum (winner's) points in each division will be:
Prem 2000
Div 1 1000
Div 2 500
Div 3 250
Awarding Points
Points for host division paddlers will be calculated as if paddle-ups were not present (as now).
Paddle-up competitors will be awarded the same points as the closest (better) paddler in the host division. If a host class is inquorate, points will be assigned by comparing modified scores with the K1M results.
Promotion
Promotion targets will be revised in line with the maximum points applying to each division.

[HPPaddle]

Looking at the stated aims of PP, a few thoughts:

As paddle up is already permitted, as are judging opportunities, how does PP provide "Additional races and access to bigger water for paddlers" that isn't already available in the current system? The PP proposal does not seem to address this aim by permitting anything that isn't currently permitted.
Event profitability may be improved, but isn't paddle up is already available as are double division events? It is not clear how PP will achieve this aim. Again, the PP proposal does not seem to address this aim by permitting anything that isn't currently permitted.
Single division events will give a clear focus on the standard of the event. Currently multi division events should be aimed at the standard of the higher division, so this isn't a change, although sometimes combined events do appear to be "soft options" for the higher division.

Looking at the aims of PP, the only thing that is actually changing (single division events giving more focus to the standard of the relevant division) seems to be something that could easily be achieved without the introduction of a new and complex points system. Other than that, the only other thing I can see is the opportunity for paddle up points which are greater than a win or less than a win, and which can be carried forward. I'm not sure there was a huge clamor across the sport for this change.

Are there some other reasons for PP? The stated aims (i) don't seem to warrant the level of upheaval proposed, and (ii) don't seem to be met by the proposal. It feels like the proposals are very similar to the emperors new clothes.

[CeeBee]

Portable Points allows paddlers to race at the next Division and always earn points. This is essentially an extension of paddles up but allows all paddlers 'paddling up' to earn some points rather than the current system where if you do well enough by beating 40% of the class, you can earn 1000 points but otherwise you get nothing. These points will all count towards promotion and ranking position.

It continues to allow paddlers to race in the Division above when their sibling/friends may already be racing but by earning points, gives paddlers more options so a Div 1 paddler may do 3 Div 1 races and 2 Prem races to get their ranking points for the year. Some paddlers are limited in the races they can attend due to other commitments and this gives them another choice which means they are more likely to stay in the sport.

Like it or not, paddlers are definitely very motivated by earning ranking points. Obviously, you should only paddle up if you are comfortable on that water level but this is self selecting as paddlers typically don't paddle up on water that they have not yet mastered.

The revised points system is easy to understand and doubles as you go up the Divisions. This is easy to calculate and paddlers will quickly get used to it. You know you need to finish in the top few over 5 races to get promoted and this will still be the same.

[Canadian Paddler]

The motion received 51 votes for and 21 votes against, with 6 abstentions. It was therefore adopted.
Following the adoption of this motion, the points targets were adjusted in the previous motions to reflect the changed divisional maximums. This was as originally proposed with each motion and agreed by the meeting.

[HPPaddle]

Trying to explain the rule changes to children in division 2:

Last year if you did a paddle up in division 1 you had to beat 40% of the paddlers in the division above in order to gain any points, if you did you got the equivalent of a win.

Next year, if you beat 40% of the paddlers in division 1, the points you are awarded won't be "promotion points". To gain promotion points from a paddle up you now need to beat 45% of the paddlers in the host division or 50% to gain equivalent of a win.

[djberriman]

This is true, it was done to keep things simple, however there are benefits, wherever they finish they get some points which they can use in Div 2 towards their total and their rank and also start in their new division when promoted with those points gained when paddling up.

There were only 7 paddlers who gained promotion from Div 2 to Div 1 through PU results out of 103.

A quick analysis shows the following.

2 paddlers would not have got a win which they used in their promotion.
2 paddlers who did 2 or 3 PU's would have just missed out on a win in one of their results.
The rest weren't affected.

In all cases it looks like they would been promoted soon after as they were acheiving very good results.

[Dee]

A thought regarding the HPP competition with prem heats on Saturday followed by prem finals and div 1 on Sunday.
My understanding is that this is generally thought of as to single division events so doesn't fall foul of the new "no double divisions" rules.

If div 1s enter the prem as paddle ups, then they could either:
1. not get through to the finals but get points from prem and the div 1
2. get through to the finals and not be allowed to do finals and div 1, potentially earning fewer total points than those in 1.
3. get through to the finals and also compete in the div 1s giving them the opportunity of four runs down the same course (and the potential advantages and disadvantages that has)

What will happen?
Is there anything in the rules that allows organisers to deny paddle up entry in these circumstances?

Curiosity killed the cat.........

[djberriman]

Remember that Paddle ups are not competing in the race, they are just compared to the results. So they can paddle up at the prem on the Sat and get points based on their results compared to the prem paddlers. Thus they can not qualify. I think this was made clear at the ACM. I'm not totally sure at which point they drop out based on the three example formats but I would guess they get 2 runs.

On the Sunday they enter as a Div 1.

[Dee]

So their points are limited by the fact that the cannot compete in the final or semi-final?

[Arrowcraft]

The portable points issue might have a very serious consequence.

If you are in div 1, this will give you 20 races from which to gain the promotion points that you need in order to get to Prem. This is instead of the 10 that you have currently. This means that there will be a lot more promoted to Prem and this division will swell and the "excellence" of the division will reduce on the average which is a developmental backwards step.. There will be paddlers in Prem that would not normally be good enough to get there. Is this good for the sport? Is there any point in moving paddlers that cannot normally get out of div 1 into Prem?

It is easier to get to prem towards the end of the season when the top 5 or 6 boats from div 1 have finished fighting it out amongst themselves and been promoted. The summer Washburn Div 1 is usually the tipping point. This tipping point will most likely move to the Tully Div 1 at Easter. Once the best Div 1's have cleared out, the ones left are usually next years top 5 or 6. But under the portable points system, they will get promoted this year and miss out on a year of div 1 racing experience. It's hard to get to Prem and that's how it should be because that's how you sharpen your racing edge and master your craft.

I am not sure that devaluing the status of our elite division is going to achieve what as a sport we need to achieve. Our top division needs to be very hard to get into and harder to stay in. The numbers in Prem need to be controlled and limited in order to make sure that only our top and most competitive paddlers get to race there. This is where we select our champions from and needs to be more competitive, not less competitive, as it will surely become.

That said, div 1 is too big. So lets address the elephant in the room...we need something between Div 1 and Prem. Call it The Championship if you like. Make Prem a fixed number of boats. 10 up 10 down from at the end of each year, No in season promotion to Prem. It takes a season to get used to Prem and paddlers promoted last year normally get to score enough points from the in season promotees to stay up...In a ten up, ten down system, there are no in season promotees to feast on. You either win enough points or you are demoted back to The Championship... That's elite sport.

Maybe insist on 3 wins for in season promotion from div 3 upwards. So you are a master of your division before moving up to the next. Then make adjustments at the end of the season if required to maintain numbers.

Whether we like it or not, we have to keep Prem as the most competitive division. Allowing 20 races to get your points instead of 10 will simply devalue Prem.

We need more higher level races. Portable points will essentially move everyone into Prem over time. It just moves one of the problems on rather than solving it.

Any thoughts?

[Arrowcraft]

Portable Points looks like it has not been thought through fully and a serious mistake has been made. We need to start thinking about how to put it right for next year.

[Arrowcraft]

Next season, there may be as many as 52 K1 men promoted to Prem create a division of around 120 Paddlers and over 170 in 2018? Possibly 30 K1 ladies (84 in Prem and then 115 the following year), C1 W 16 Promoted ( 41 then 60) and C1 M 22 promoted (67 then 90) So premier will have more than doubled in size from the end of 2015 to the end of 2018...

That is not a sustainable pattern and it is up to us all, as custodians of our sport to deal with this.

We need another division between 1 & Prem or we need a completely different way to rank paddlers and races.

[John Sturgess]

As soon as something like this comes up, we start talking about Divisions - about Promotion - in fact about Rationing (in this case we are saying that there are not enough racing slots on rough water for all the people who want to race on rough water: so how do we decide who 'deserves' them most..?)

I may be one of the few people in Slalom who remembers rationing: not something we want to go back to.

Time to forget the Stafford Cripps model (google him) and go for the Aldi/Lidl model as also used in every other slalom country I know of: create more capacity so that everybody can get what they want. (i.e. more races on rough water; and solve the oversubscription model by putting two races on at opposite ends of the country on the same day.

Can any reply please not mention fairness!

[paddlerparent]

If you are in div 1, this will give you 20 races from which to gain the promotion points that you need in order to get to Prem. This is instead of the 10 that you have currently.

I dont see where you get teh numbers from - there are the same number of races in Div1 + Prem next year as this year. Furthermore as someone pointed out, you will now need to beat 45% of prem paddlers to get 'promotion worthy' points where as last year it was only 40%.


SO i'm not sure i get what you are trying to explain re promotions