Address /DOB should be omitted from entry cards. - Data protection

80-1219672301 · Post by **80-1219672301** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 11:59 am

Has there actually ever been a problem viz this issue that we know of? I've never seen the address side publically displayed or indeed the DOB. I guess there is an issue if people are pulling the cards off the display board to look at them but then they're pretty obvious?

Maybe score notice boards like the one at Llangollen is the answer where the cards are behind perspex. just showing Division, M or W, Category, bib number and age ranking and run times.

Alternatively should we go completely elecronic with entries ?(saves trees and post miles

) and have results electronically displayed - Probably quite an ask for some venues!

Carlr · Post by **Carlr** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 12:29 pm

I really dont understand all the fuss about this (surely better things to do in life to do than moan about entry card info). This system has been around since i started competing back in the late 70s and works well why complicate things more. Organisers of events have enough to do as it is.

PaulBolton · Post by **PaulBolton** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:55 pm

In the 70s there wasn't a real issue with identity theft - but things (unfortunately) move on - after all, it was nearly 40 years ago. Having a small debate on whether things can be improved and/or made more secure is surely a good thing? Do we want to wait until something undesirable has happened until we have this debate or do we want to review our procedures now and see if there is a way ahead that has no impact on efficiency yet makes our system more secure? I favour the latter and if the admin burden etc then makes "do nothing" the best option I have no problem with that. I do think though that with modern, instant global communication methods (email from phones which also take high quality photographs etc) an examination investigating sensible precautions and security of data is both wise and timely.

Carlr · Post by **Carlr** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:46 pm

We are talking about canoe slalom here, so as usual nothing will happen it never does, especially if it is going to cost £££££.

katonas · Post by **katonas** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:44 pm

Option 2 in the voting list should read 'Address/DOB side of card on display to the public' ie. card not behind perspex/able to be removed by a passer by (try picking up a few cards at the next event and see if anyone questions you). If my PC hadn't voted for me, I'd have voted for this option (no major change needed except perhaps a new display board)

I'm not quite sure whether anyone has grasped the other solution I proposed, which is for organisers to have access to the same information ranking compilers have. Once allowed, it would be quicker to fill in cards, and more information would be available to organisers (rather than just having the telephone number of the paddler's mobile in their locked car) . You could always password protect the file,if you were worried someone might steal the organisers PC.

Surely it is not such a big change for ranking compilers to email an organiser with an up to date list of all paddlers' contact details/DOB in all divisions just before their event.

There should be a rule insisting that organisers dispose of event cards in a proper fashion (if there isn't already), although after the event the information could only be used for identity fraud, and not by prospective burglars. Shredding 200 thick cards is a time consuming business, so I wonder how many cards haven't had this sort of treatment.

Why take a risk, when the solutions are so straight forward. Are the organisers willing to foot the bill for £30,000 of damages if a paddler thinks their burglary or identity theft 'could' have been the result of a card at an event (however likely). Perhaps the organiser is happy to hope the BCU might foot the legal bill for them.

How many of the 500+ paddlers that enter slaloms every yr will be subject to identity theft after the event, or a burglary while they are at the event. Over the next 30years, how likely...? As an organiser can you prove that the information was safe, and disposed of in the correct manner if someone makes a claim against you?

If 'nothing happens'... I won't be affected because I'm not an organiser, and my DOB/address will not be on my card unless pre-event assurances are made. If my entry is refused, then so be it.

Just to make it clear-
Address = Concern on the day of the event only
DOB=Concern anytime after the event. I doubt DOB is available on google. I couldn't find mine. Its one of the questions my bank asks me when I ring them.

Dee · Post by **Dee** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 7:42 pm

try picking up a few cards at the next event and see if anyone questions you

If anyone tries this I will be seeking to disqualify them from the event - an organisers life is hard enough without this sort of suggestion.

PeterC · Post by **PeterC** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:29 pm

The ranking compilers should not pass on the details of all potential competitors but only those that have properly entered as otherwise they could be in breach of the data protection act passing on information that is not required. We would therefore need information to be able to identify those paddlers that had entered!!!

Please let us have a little sanity here. Organisers are not going to be liable for burglaries unless they can clearly be shown to have been negligent and that this negligence demonstrably led to a loss. There are much easier ways to identify empty properties than swiping entry cards at a slalom event!!! There are usually a large group studying the cards and anyone trying to half inch them would probably need psychiatric help.

At least let us keep address and year of birth.

PeterC · Post by **PeterC** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:51 pm

By the way Katonas it took me less than 4 minutes to identify you in detail and then from this your date of birth on line. I believe it is [*EDITED*]. I have the day of the month as well but not appropriate to post that here.

Yes I do work part time in the confidential information business but can assure you that I have broken no rules and only used information that is publicly available to anyone and indeed everyone if they know where to look. It would not be appropriate to say exactly how it was done.

Sadly we do live in an era when identity theft is rife and yes I have been a victim. Yes I am very careful and I do shred absolutely everything. We have to be alert and minimise the risk but we simply cannot eliminate it. I would assure you that the risk of putting your date of birth on a slalom entry card is very very low and there are very much easier ways of finding it. If your bank only uses your date of birth to identify you then I would suggest perhaps time to move bank!!

Also the next threat is cold calling pretending to be your bank and after you have answered asking you to confirm your identity to them. Sadly 99% of people do!!!

Edited By SteveM on 1228953704

katonas · Post by **katonas** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:47 am

PeterC - Please could you edit your posting to remove my month and year of birth.

Seedy Paddler · Post by **Seedy Paddler** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:48 am

Steve

Before you sound off on what Organisers should do - you should spend some time as an Organiser.

I have sat with a single entry card the Friday evening before an event - when do I verify data with a Ranking List Compiler? I also know of a similar situation at a Div 2/3/4 double event when the Thursday evening before the event the organiser had 5 entries. At both sites mobile phone and WiFi networks are poor so we cannot sit and scan the internet.

The risk from you Entry Card is much more minimal than the risk from the internet - as with Peter - I have a piece of paper here with your home address, date of birth, home telephone number. I could also provide your wifes name and a date of entry and price for your home. All publicly and freely available from the comfort of my own home, I don't need to run the risk of someone exposing me for rummaging among slalom cards.

I am also aware of at least two of your family interests and with a bit of intuition could probably come up with a few dates (days or evenings) when you may not be home.

Prehaps "your wife" treated you to an early birthday present during the day trip to London! If not best of luck if you have a team in the QuizNite tomorrow ???

katonas · Post by **katonas** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:55 am

Seedy paddler - please remove my wife's name from your posting.

Seedy Paddler · Post by **Seedy Paddler** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 12:58 am

Happy to oblige!

katonas · Post by **katonas** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:11 am

Thankyou for pointing out that my DOB was visible in the area you mentioned. It has now been removed. I've asked for this topic to also be removed, before anyone else sees fit to trawl up, and display more of my family's personal details (true or false). Before anyone else attacks me for my comments, please consider that I had the sports best interests at heart.

ps. regarding those who voted yes above, perhaps their concerns should be dismissed as paranoia, and their personal details publicised to show them how wrong they are.

Canadian Paddler · Post by **Canadian Paddler** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 11:17 am

As a div 3/4 organiser where most entries are on the day, any idea of multiple papers, or looking up names on lists scares me, I am busy enough.

BUT I never look further than the year of birth, and would be happy to accept a card with just a year, and for teh next batch of cards to be printed to only request the year. (Age is no good, as you do not move up by having a birthday, it is your age on 1st Jan)

Munchkin · Post by **Munchkin** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 11:46 am

Just out of curiosity (I don't mind my date of birth being known but can never remember my C2's partners!) if you are senior can you just put senior on the card?